InfestedKerrigan Posted November 4, 2017 Report Share Posted November 4, 2017 The problem as I see it, Pax, is that you are using The Units Leadership and The Dark Apostles Leadership interchangeably, inappropriately. Let's call the unit Tiger Squadron. Tiger Squadron has 7 Ld. Tiger Commander has Ld 8. Tiger Squadron is part of the Black Legion, giving them +1 Ld TS Ld 8 TC Ld 9 Tiger Squadron can take an Icon giving them +1 Ld TS Ld 9 TC Ld 10 Tiger Priest is a Ld 9 Dark Apostle Tiger Priest joins Black Legion TP Ld 10 Tiger Priest is an Inspiring Leader, Standing near Tiger Squadron TS 10 TC 11 TP 11 During Morale Phase, Tiger Squadron can use the Squadron Leaders 11 OR the Dark Apostles 11. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 4, 2017 Report Share Posted November 4, 2017 51 minutes ago, InfestedKerrigan said: The problem as I see it, Pax, is that you are using The Units Leadership and The Dark Apostles Leadership interchangeably, inappropriately. Let's call the unit Tiger Squadron. Tiger Squadron has 7 Ld. Tiger Commander has Ld 8. Tiger Squadron is part of the Black Legion, giving them +1 Ld TS Ld 8 TC Ld 9 Tiger Squadron can take an Icon giving them +1 Ld TS Ld 9 TC Ld 10 Tiger Priest is a Ld 9 Dark Apostle Tiger Priest joins Black Legion TP Ld 10 Tiger Priest is an Inspiring Leader, Standing near Tiger Squadron TS 10 TC 11 TP 11 During Morale Phase, Tiger Squadron can use the Squadron Leaders 11 OR the Dark Apostles 11. How does using tigers make the example better? You've said the same thing as before, but still no rules basis, which is the part that has me puzzled. I don't understand your logic in the order you apply modifiers. Sounds like you are applying a fixed value (the current leadership of the DA) AFTER you apply the bonuses to the unit's leadership. Which is the opposite of how the rules say to handle this. That said, I also don't really think the rules support using this stack the same bonus multiple times via borrowed stats, so I'm hoping for a rule that I missed to explain it. Is there an FAQ somewhere regarding borrowed stats? Hmm..the Changling borrows all sorts of stats, is he FAQed? Any others? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InfestedKerrigan Posted November 5, 2017 Report Share Posted November 5, 2017 They aren't borrowing. You are misconceptualizing it. I did use the rules. You need to read them. It doesn't say they replace their leadership with his. It says other units may use his leadership instead of their own. Flags target the unit. It's in the rules in front of you. The flag doesn't modify the Dark Apostles Leadership because he isn't a part of the damn unit, per the rules in front of you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 5, 2017 Report Share Posted November 5, 2017 1 hour ago, InfestedKerrigan said: They aren't borrowing. You are misconceptualizing it. I did use the rules. You need to read them. It doesn't say they replace their leadership with his. It says other units may use his leadership instead of their own. Flags target the unit. It's in the rules in front of you. The flag doesn't modify the Dark Apostles Leadership because he isn't a part of the damn unit, per the rules in front of you. How is using his leadership different from borrowing his leadership? Well aware that the Icon/flag doesn't target the DA since he isn't in the unit. But if the unit uses his leadership, then his leadership is their leadership. And Modifiers to their leadership should apply. And again, the rules do cover modified characteristics, which apply fixed values first, then bonuses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InfestedKerrigan Posted November 5, 2017 Report Share Posted November 5, 2017 You are trying to replace their leadership with his and make it their own. That's not what his rule says to do. But I'm kinda over trying to tell you the difference as you are stuck in how you are conceptualizing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 5, 2017 Report Share Posted November 5, 2017 Hmm...I'll think on this. It is true that your explanation does go against my conceptualization. And I do value your opinion. So I'll think on this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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