Munkie Posted July 2, 2017 Report Share Posted July 2, 2017 9 hours ago, Kremmet said: Unfortunately both abilities do not trigger until after the vehicle is destroyed so this logic doesn't work. The only timing we have been given by GW is that effects which say immediately trigger before effects that don't and, upon rereading the skills in question, SfD doesn't actually say immediately for the resolution of the ability firing and so would fire after you place the unit. With immediately being a trigger that happens before the "...each time a unit is completely destroyed..." clause of Strength from Death that does give a strong argument for SfD firing from a transport blowing up. The timing chart would be: Vehicle is Destroyed. Place the embarked units. Trigger Strength from Death on any applicable units. Remove transport. It's not saying "immediately before [the trigger for SfD]", the sentence is saying "immediately before the transport model is removed from the table" the unit is determined to be destroyed before the unit must disembark, obviously, or you wouldn't have to disembark. You determine SfD when the unit is determined to be destroyed which means it is essentially simultaneous with the last wound dealt. So to me it seems to me like the steps would be: 1) Transport takes last wound 2) (When step 1 happens) Measure SfD range, and resolve it. 3) (Immediately before step 4) Deploy troops from transport 4) Remove transport 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InfestedKerrigan Posted July 2, 2017 Report Share Posted July 2, 2017 I think this is too complicated and we need to squat 8th edition. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kremmet Posted July 2, 2017 Report Share Posted July 2, 2017 The difference in the two rules is that disembark is an immediate effect while Strength from Death is not. The rule 's immediacy clause is in general talking about what to do before removing the model, but it also gives us a timing window for any simultaneous effects that trigger upon the death of that vehicle. Both of the rules are not simultaneous as VonVilkee is implying as, again, the only timing reference we're given as a difference in the two rules is that the unit immediately disembarks upon the transport's destruction while SfD does not immediately fire. Munkie&VonVilkee: both effects are essentially simultaneous with the loss of the last wound of the vehicle. We're all on the same page about what we want the rule to do I think (i.e. not fire SfD), but the timing rules as they exist now are not leaning towards that interpretation. Both rules fire upon the destroyed result, but one rule tells you to resolve it immediately and the other does not. For timing purposes, this is telling you the order in which to resolve the three simultaneous effects going on when the transport is destroyed (disembark, SfD, and removal of the vehicle). 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMGraham Posted July 2, 2017 Report Share Posted July 2, 2017 And, the FAQ addresses it! Quote YNNARI Q. If a transport is destroyed whilst an Ynnari unit is embarked inside, can that unit make a Soulburst action after it disembarks? A. No. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kremmet Posted July 2, 2017 Report Share Posted July 2, 2017 1 minute ago, JMGraham said: And, the FAQ addresses it! And I was just coming around on it too. Solved forever. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Threejacks Posted July 3, 2017 Report Share Posted July 3, 2017 Got a few questions from the tournament yesterday in Sherwood. The main one that came up a few times is having to do with consolidation at the end of a units fight phase.If an opponent has been wiped out does the unit that finished them off get to consolidate as per the final step in the combat phase rules?..and if so could the "nearest enemy model" be several inches or even feet away?.Seems rather screwey but,on the surface,thats what the rule looks like to me.I was told though that if a unit gets wiped,the attacking unit that finidhed them off doesnt get to consolidate,,,I dont see were that comes from though. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestRider Posted July 3, 2017 Report Share Posted July 3, 2017 Oops, answered this in the other thread. Would have been better here. Anyhow: 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Threejacks Posted July 3, 2017 Report Share Posted July 3, 2017 10 minutes ago, WestRider said: Oops, answered this in the other thread. Would have been better here. Anyhow: Yeah,,thats my take on it too,,and the only wierd thing is the nearest enemy model could be across the board,but oh well,heh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusldorf Posted July 3, 2017 Report Share Posted July 3, 2017 10 hours ago, Threejacks said: Yeah,,thats my take on it too,,and the only wierd thing is the nearest enemy model could be across the board,but oh well,heh. Just keep in mind that you can move anywhere with your consolidation so long as you end a teensy bit closer to the nearest enemy model. So it actually gives you quite a bit of flexibility sometimes. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sugarlessllama Posted July 3, 2017 Report Share Posted July 3, 2017 On 6/18/2017 at 10:11 AM, peter.cosgrove said: Blood Angel Assaults can no longer take 2 melta's. The new FAQ has this entry which should make you happy. Page 89 – Wargear Add the following before the final paragraph: ‘Models in Assault Squads that have the option for a flamer may take a meltagun or plasma gun instead (replacing their bolt pistol and chainsword).’ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter.cosgrove Posted July 4, 2017 Author Report Share Posted July 4, 2017 hehe.. hehe.. And you can take short squads and pay less for them.. hehe.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarlordGhrom Posted July 6, 2017 Report Share Posted July 6, 2017 On 7/4/2017 at 0:39 PM, peter.cosgrove said: hehe.. hehe.. And you can take short squads and pay less for them.. hehe.. Only if you don't want friends... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skkipper Posted July 6, 2017 Report Share Posted July 6, 2017 The no fire arcs on flyers is boss. i played a 50 Point game vs my son and the fire raptor and storm eagle and heldrake shot him off the table. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spagunk Posted July 7, 2017 Report Share Posted July 7, 2017 I learned: I need to pay more attention to how much damage my units do. Missed out on so much damage because I quick glanced and thought things like meltaguns were d3 and not d6. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Munkie Posted July 7, 2017 Report Share Posted July 7, 2017 Psychic phase, psychic phase, psychic phase! I played against a Thousand Sons army and had a turn to pop the Crucible of Malediction (DE anti-psychic tech) and it would've hit 2 units of rubric marines and 2 demon princes. But you open it in the psychic phase, which DE don't usually have, so I didn't realize it until halfway through my shooting phase. It is annoying to remember I have a psychic phase maybe one per game. Also, I learned how brutal Perils of the Warp is too. The game began with me seizing the initiative and ended with the demon prince with 1 wound killing himself while trying to smite the last wrack in a squad. The hilarious part was my opponent called the perils. The prince was going to smite the wrack, and charge 2 of my skimmers to kill them. He could only fail the charge if he rolled snake eyes, so he moved the prince slightly closer to turn it into an auto-make. I commented on how cruel it would've been to end the game on a failed charge and my opponent replied "no, I'm just gonna roll the snake eyes on this psychic test instead..." 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romans832 Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 13 hours ago, Munkie said: "no, I'm just gonna roll the snake eyes on this psychic test instead..." Sometimes those make the most epic stories of all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Munkie Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 Yeah, we played it out anyway, and when he blew up the raider, it exploded and dealt him a mortal wound instead. The dice gods really wanted that demon prince dead, but not by my hand. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Munkie Posted July 13, 2017 Report Share Posted July 13, 2017 "Units that charged or have enemies within 1" can be chosen to fight" This means that if a unit swings and kills everyone within 1" of a friendly unit before that unit has swung, the other unit loses its chance to activate only if it has not charged that turn. No opportunity to pile into a combat, attack, or consolidate because they aren't an eligible choice. However, if they charged, they can still be chosen to fight with, even if there are no longer enemies anywhere near them (in this case, the only thing they'd get to do is pile in towards the closest enemy model). However however, if a non-charging unit misses its opportunity to attack because a friendly unit killed everyone within 1" first, you may still get that opportunity back later in the fight phase, if your opponent moves other models within 1" during their turn to activate. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Glacius Posted July 13, 2017 Report Share Posted July 13, 2017 The wording GW has used in its rules primer makes it impossible to use pistols within 1". Quote You may not pick a unit that Advanced or Fell Back this turn, or a unit that is within 1" of an enemy unit. The rules for pistols do not change this: Quote A model can fire a Pistol even if there are enemy units within 1" of its own unit, but it must target the closest enemy unit. Why? because it doesn't allow you to chose the unit. In choosing who can shoot, you can't choose a unit with models within 1" of the enemy. While a model can fire if it is within 1" due to a pistol, you can't select that unit to begin with. Has this been FAQ'd? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pretre Posted July 13, 2017 Report Share Posted July 13, 2017 Same thing with assault weapons after advancing. The RAI seems sort of clear though. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psilence Posted July 14, 2017 Report Share Posted July 14, 2017 In this case wouldn't the language in the pistols rules allow it to fire? It takes the negative (you can't) and supersedes with the positive (you can). Seems like a clear RAW. But what do I know? ;) Things I've learned, space wolf addition: 1. Use your rerolls. I ended a game last night with 4 left over, I pretty much spaced them out :p 2. Space wolf HQ's are tough hombres, but will still get their teeth kicked in if they're out of position (happened in 2 games so far). 3. Drop pods don't explode. Color me surprised :) 4. Most of the thunder cav's damage comes from the mount. I guess when something that big is chewing on you you'd notice. 5. Sometimes you just have to let the wolf wolf. ;) Still happy with 8th. Herald is bravely off in a corner getting murdered by deep strikers :p 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestRider Posted July 14, 2017 Report Share Posted July 14, 2017 37 minutes ago, Psilence said: 5. Sometimes you just have to let the wolf wolf. ;) Just don't let the Moon Moon ;) 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ish Posted July 14, 2017 Report Share Posted July 14, 2017 46 minutes ago, WestRider said: Just don't let the Moon Moon ;) And don't let the Slaaneshi daemons Snoo Snoo. No matter how nicely they ask. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Threejacks Posted July 14, 2017 Report Share Posted July 14, 2017 2 hours ago, Psilence said: In this case wouldn't the language in the pistols rules allow it to fire? It takes the negative (you can't) and supersedes with the positive (you can). Seems like a clear RAW. But what do I know? ;) Things I've learned, space wolf addition: 1. Use your rerolls. I ended a game last night with 4 left over, I pretty much spaced them out :p 2. Space wolf HQ's are tough hombres, but will still get their teeth kicked in if they're out of position (happened in 2 games so far). 3. Drop pods don't explode. Color me surprised :) 4. Most of the thunder cav's damage comes from the mount. I guess when something that big is chewing on you you'd notice. 5. Sometimes you just have to let the wolf wolf. ;) Still happy with 8th. Herald is bravely off in a corner getting murdered by deep strikers :p " Most of the thunder cav's damage comes from the mount. I guess when something that big is chewing on you you'd notice." Yup!..and I finally started using the mounts attacks on my third game!(in a 3 game tournament) Also Wulfen get to attack before being removed if they are in combat range...which I will use in every game I play with them from now on! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pretre Posted July 14, 2017 Report Share Posted July 14, 2017 4 hours ago, Psilence said: In this case wouldn't the language in the pistols rules allow it to fire? It takes the negative (you can't) and supersedes with the positive (you can). Seems like a clear RAW. The contention: The pistol and assault weapons do allow you to fire your pistol when you shoot, but the rules for shooting say that the unit can't even be chosen during the shooting phase if they advanced or are within 1". So the pistol rules should say something like 'a unit with pistol weapons can still be chosen to fire during the shooting phase but can only fire pistol weapons.' 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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